BS I'm going to take a quick step back now and ask how would you describe science. What does science mean to you?
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DB: Um, um. a lot about the perceptions I think people have of science. I - I was never very good at science. Perhaps that's a whole explanation, my rationale. I - I love the idea that you can - you can investigate something you can think "oh that's, that's how something is going to happen." And - the engineering bit, which is where I come from where, scientists come up with how something functions how something works and then the engineers put it to use and they find a way of actually using what the scientists have managed to come up with. Means that I come from it with a very, great respect for the people that are, that are doing it and that are pushing the boundaries. Because of the engineering background I think I probably - like to think that, I don't know, I don't know. I mean - In some ways I think science is a tool, you know science is the tool that gives us, gives, Darren Barnes the, the wherewithal to actually, build things, whatever it happens to be, or for people to build things. But, I think they're very closely linked with the engineering side because so many of the great scientists have, have got all the problem solving skills that, that any engineer has to apply in the same way. So, this sort of engineering scientist divide - I don't see as, you know, I don't see it as a great issue because I think, many engineers are scientists and many scientists are engineers. And it's just that sort of, that, that kind of, aptitude to be able to think about, a problem and solve it, using the tools that are available. And if, the tool isn't there, you, make a new one.