BS: We were talking about the development of the MSc programme.
TS: It was developed by more or less single handed, so far as I know, by Brian Delf. My involvement in I think the first group was very very slight. That is when I was in the education department, I used to a bit of educational psychology as applied to the learning of science and kids' naive science ideas and I did the session on that. And that was all I did I think in the - in the first session. I think that Brian Delf only did the thing for about a year and a half. And after that time - Melanie Quinn who also worked here took over as the director of the course and I was involved in the thing more or less from that time. That is I did some - dissertation supervision, things like that towards the end of course number 2, I think. But I haven't written this down so I don't know if it's exactly that but I think it is that course. At the time it - we didn't have premises here, the premises were across there next to the Coal Exchange and I think we used those for a couple of years before we had the present building which is a temporary building out in the yard.